How Marriott Vistana Is Failing Their Owners During Covid-19
I had reader Joyce reach out to me about some issues that Marriott Vistana owners are having during these trying times. Marriott Vistana is Marriott’s timeshare company that was founded after the purchase of Starwood. They merged multiple timeshare companies into one and named it Vistana (almost as bad as Bonvoy!). Most timeshare companies have been willing to work with their owners during the pandemic. They have been extending their points expiration dates, allowing cancellations easily, mortgage forbearance etc. It appears that Marriott Vistana is failing their owners instead of working with them. They have provided the bare minimum in terms of assistance with everything going on. Joyce was willing to share her experience with me.
Marriott Vistana’s Normal Cancellation Policy
The cancellation policy is somewhat strict under normal circumstances but understandable to keep integrity in the program. Here is a quick rundown of the terms that come into play during this situation:
- Cancellations made less than 60 days in advance came with a $50 fee
- Any points associated with the cancellation were placed on restricted status.
- The points were now only bookable 60 days in advance versus the normal 8 months.
- The points would also expire at the end of the current calendar year.
- You could no longer bank the points for up to 2 years (added fee to bank points)
- You could no longer transfer your points to the Bonvoy hotel program. (This is a last ditch effort to get some value before points expired)
Changes Made To Cancellations Because Of Covid-19
When Covid-19 brought all travel to a halt overnight many owners needed to cancel their travel plans that were only weeks away. Marriott was willing to do the bare minimum during these early days. They would waive the $50 cancellation fee for bookings within the 60 day windows. But everything else in their strict cancellation policy would remain the same.
After a mere 2-3 weeks and many angry phone calls, emails and Facebook group posts Marriott made some changes to their policy. They made some accommodations to the owners:
- Marriott would extend the reservation window from 60 days to 120 days in advance.
- They also further extended the points available only until the end of 2021.
This sounds like a reasonable adjustment for folks outside the program but Joyce says not so fast:
Now some would say this was generous on Marriott Vistana’s part. However, those of us who own any of these properties know better! This is horrendous based on the time allotted to make reservations and the availability of high value properties which most of us are tied up in.
Why This Change Is Not As Good As It Seems
Extending the validity of the points until the end of 2021 was a good move on Marriott’s part in my opinion. But leaving a booking cap on those points is the real issue here. Many of the properties booked were done so at 8 months out, as all of the best properties need to be done. So by limiting the points to 4 months out Marriott Vistana is pretty much guaranteeing that they will be used at less desirable properties or at inopportune times, think Arizona in the peak of summer.
Some of these owners spent thousands of dollars and paid fees to roll over points for a few years to amass enough points for these expensive bookings. Now they will have no shot to redeem them at the properties that they spent all of that money to book. All Marriott had to do was remove the booking restrictions on these points and people would have felt taken care of. Even though they would likely still have points expire because they couldn’t use them in time at least they would have an opportunity to try.
It appears Marriott is more concerned with future sales versus taking care of their current owners. Here is an excerpt from an email Joyce received from a Vice President of Customer Advocacy with Marriott Vistana:
With the number of increasing resort closures and travel restrictions, we are constantly looking at ways to assist our owners in rebooking their vacations at a later date. However, that cannot come at the risk of impacting future vacation availability. I am pleased to inform you that we have been working around the clock to come up with a solution that assists owners impacted by COVID-19, while maintaining the integrity of the program and ensuring we do not impact future owner vacations
How Competitors Have Handled The Situation
Joyce has read letters from both Disney and Hilton written to their and they are lifting all restrictions on cancellations. Whether the cancellations are inside or outside 60 days due to this event. Neither of these competitors have restricted options or points for their owners. They are allowing the system to take over and owners to seek their own destinations. Joyce says that “this is a more just and fair approach for people that spend thousands of dollars to acquire these points”.
What About Forbearance?
I discussed the potential risks of taking advantage of forbearance programs when it comes to your mortgage. I advised you to read the terms because the programs are not always what it seems.
Some Marriott Vistana owners that have been furloughed or lost their jobs have reached out about a possible forbearance program on their timeshare ownership. Marriott Vistana responded that they don’t fall under any government regulations for mortgages. Because of that they not offering any forgiveness and will send anyone not making payments to collections. If you are an owner and were seeking some relief via this route it appears that is not an option.
Final Thoughts From Joyce
There are many, many owners who stand to lose thousands of dollars because of this. Trust me, I can see where folks are losing employment, etc., and do feel very sorry about all this. I realize that there is nothing that can be done at my level anymore. This level of service or non-service from Marriott is unbelievable! As a corporation, Marriott has again failed! All this could be salvaged to each owner’s satisfaction by just waiving the cancellation policy. We could then move forward to get through this together.
Conclusion
Companies have been put in a tough spot with these unprecedented events. Some have handled it better than others for sure. Others have succumbed to the financial burden involved and made horrible decisions that take advantage of their customers.
I would have thought vacation ownership programs would have been better suited for something like this since they continue to receive their mortgage payments, dues and every other fee under the sun even when properties are shut down. People are not expecting for these payments to go on hold but rather that they keep the value they have already paid for. Removing the cancellation terms on the points does not add any more cost. It could overload the system slightly for a few years but I think everyone would understand that. At least it gives the owners affected a fighting chance.
Do you think Marriott Vistana is failing their owners during Covid-19? Share your thoughts or experiences below.
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I feel that they are failing their owners terribly. We live in Australia and were due to go to Hawaii in October until COVID. We are not able to leave the country and so we will lose thousands of points and dollars as we were going to use banked options. I have reached out to the company 3 times throughout the year. They simply offer us no options that we are able to use and we stand to lose it all as it expires on 31 Dec 2020. This is really poor customer service and I am really disappointed in what used to be a really positive experience in the past.
It is amazing how little they have been willing to do. Sorry to hear about your cancelled trip.
I agree this has been handled miserably. We had to cancel our May 2020 vacation and I was pleased to hear points would be valid through Dec 2021. But when I tried to book 8 months out, I was told that it’s only possible to book 4 months out with these “restricted points”. Restricted points that cost me a fortune for my two bedroom oceanfront property in Hawaii. We were considering purchasing more points but that won’t be happening now. I’ll be lucky if I get to use it at all in 2021. I have to work around kid school schedules which will make it impossible to book so last minute.
Talk around the pool used to be positive ways to use your ownership and the enjoyment owners have using the properties. Since Marriott took over the positive talk has turned negative due to the variety of benefits lost or watered down. Now with the lack of Marriott leadership during the Covid 19 pandemic owners are going to steer new potential owners away from the program. Until Marriott sets up a better policy during the Covid 19 pandemic to protect the value of our ownership, I see no need to purchase anything additional or to promote a low par product.
Lifting the 120 day reservation restriction and extending the use of options they perhaps 2022 or further would very likely pacify most owners. I am an original Starwood owner and from the second Marriott became controlling ownership I have felt let down, cheated during the points conversion for hotels and although for many years I touted the great advantages of timeshare ownership, I will no longer encourage anyone to look to Marriott ownership.
absolutely agree but in the meantime there has to be something we as owners can do to lobby Vistana to see the errors of their ways – unless band together and make our feelings known no change will come
I could not agree with you more. Every time we would sit around the pool that is where most of the transactions would occur for future purchases of timeshares. All they will hear now will be complaining and how they feel slighted
AGREE with all the points made here — we are in the same boat had a family reunion planned for April in Palm Springs with 3 two bedroom lock offs — took forever to work out the logistics and had to cancel within the 60 day window. Now I m stuck with the points and a restricted 120 day booking window which I will not be able to do anything with ? Couple that with many of the resorts being in current COVID hot spots and we couldn’t use them if we wanted too for likely 2020. Competing programs have made concessions no one at Vistana has been able to help and they just aren’t listening ? You CAN’T find any Executive on line to complaint too there doesn’t seem to be an Ombudsman or Consumer Complaints officer to raise this with they are all hiding !!! When the annual fees statement arrives WHY should I pay when we have been denied vacation access and no one ever responds ?? Maybe we need to take more collaborative and connected action as owners and consumers ? Welcome any thoughts
After going through all this for many months, all I can now think is when time comes for “owner update”, we all tell Vistana how disappointed we are in their handling of this unusual situation. Perhaps reach out to a time share sell team to dump your points and get rid of the maintenance fees forever. I know that will actually cost money to accomplish. Or just view it as having an apartment in another city and having to pay the rent even though you only use it part time as if for employment. I have tried to think of ways to get over this over time but I am out of ideas. Bottom line if you want to keep your points and use them whenever we get to a point where they are usable, then just move forward on this. But if you want out, then consider other options.
I agree that Vistana has been deplorable with their responses or lack of responses. Their continued verse of “we have to save the integrity of the entire program” is ridiculous. But now I believe we have more important items to take up our time. Up to you but just my opinion. Good luck. Hope you can find a workable solution for you and your family.
I agree with you completely. Cannot use the timeframe where we bought and then 120 restrictions for future bookings. Should not have to pay maintenance fees. Wish we never bought there!
I live in California and work as a licensed massage therapist. Because of Covid19 I am under mandatory lock down and was told to cease massage activity or have my license revoked. I called Vistana to ask about forbearance as I have no income right now. They have nothing to offer and will foreclose the timeshare if I fail to make the payments. All my other creditors are working with me. I’m very disappointed in this company and will be sure to share my experience with anyone who will listen so I can warn them to purchase elsewhere.
Super disappointing experience as an owner with Vistana. I am unsuccessful in finding emails for any of their executive leadership. I see many people share this frustration for finding an unacceptable solution in a very unique environment. I understand having parameters in place for “normal” circumstances; however, this is unique and have an opportunity to serve their best customers with an appropriate level of service.
Please let me know if anyone can provide a contact. The customer service agent would not provide outside of their general comment email.
We own a 2 bdrm lockoff oceanview in Maui on even years and a large premium villa in Scottsdale Westin Kierland annual since 2004 and 2006. Than added a Westin Flex even years to our portfolio with the idea we would do a three family Maui vacation with our son and daughter’s families and 5 grandchildren. It was tricky to schedule but as owners we were able to do it a year in advance for a 10 night stay. We are sure with the 14 day quarantine it will be cancelled for our June reservations. I have called multiple times but if I cancel under the 60 day, which is gone now, the points become restricted and only 120 days out for booking. The chance of using the options for anything is slim to none. At least if they were not restricted I could bank them or move to hotel points. The 120 days hurts this as well. I could not cancel further in advance as our airline tickets for 11 people were already purchased and unless the flights are cancelled the airline give you vouchers for future travel and not cash refund. We need the cash refund so are hoping for flight cancellation than we will cancel the room reservations. If the flights are not cancelled than we go but not if 14 day quarantine is still in effect. Can you publish the address of Mr. Weiss as I was given his name as either the CEO or President for all of the owners to write to requesting change of this unfair policy. Also, we should consider taking ads out in trade papers, magazines and any other means of communication to potential buyers regarding the treatment of owners. This is a pandemic not just a regular situation we are facing.
Much thanks Mark for your article and your insight. Some here will disagree but that is neither here nor there. Perhaps Marriott/Vistana will hear our cries and your insightful article.
I hope all timeshare companies come up with some type of game plan that works for the owners. You all spend a lot of money with them and deserve to be taken care of.
“Marriott Vistana is Marriott’s timeshare company that was founded after the purchase of Starwood. They merged multiple timeshare companies into one and named it Vistana”
This is incorrect. Vistana was Starwoods Timeshare business that was spun off many years ago and merged with ILG (which I believe also operates the Hyatt vacation program, again entirely separte from Hyatt Hotels). Manny years before that Marriot Hotels spun off Marriot Vacations Group. By the time Marriot and Starwood (the hotels business) merged, the respective timeshare businesses had been entirely separated each with its own legal entity, employees, and shareholders. Two years ago and years after the hotels businesses merged, Marriott Vacations purchased ILG, which incidentally included the old Starwood timeshare business. The new company, Marriott Vacations remains separate from Marriott Hotels – Marriott Hotels does not have a “timeshare business”.
Which is to say, blaming Marriott (hotels) Bonvoy for the behavior of Vistana is a little like saying American Airlines sucks because Dollar car rental won’t refund a car reservation you made with your AAdvantage miles. Even if Marriott (hotels) wanted to help, they don’t have any real management or economic authority over Vistana, as it is owned by an entirely different entity.
Thanks for the insight H
Which being starwood first point system was much better before they merged with Marriott. They need to do something more for this covid with restrictions still have to pay maintenance fee on property u own and cannot use. Was much better before marriot.
I’m a MVC owner and generally disagree with Joyce’s position. Timeshares are obligated weeks (or days) for the owners. It sucks if they cannot be used this year, but that’s part of ownership. Two years ago, hurricanes in the Caribbean and Carolinas greatly impacted usage there. Many weeks were lost. Asking MVC to simply advance a chunk of time from this year into next year compounds a problem. 16 months of usage won’t fit into 12 months or 2021. If I owned a vacation home and couldn’t use it this year (for any reason), I couldn’t use it for two years next year to make up time. These are not elastic accommodations. They are not hurting people this year for new sales. Next year is already going to be spoken for. We have to bite the bullet. I’ve had to cancel two trips and in the scheme of what others are going through. That’s small potatoes.
Fair points Todd. I would say when timeshares were tethered to one particular property that made more sense to me but with them going to a points system I think they could be more flexible. Even if it is opening up the option to transfer to Bonvoy points etc.
The timeshare companies are still being paid for everything as if it were normal but are not incurring the normal cost to run the facilities. It isn’t like other businesses where they lost their revenue stream because of this so I think they could do more.
There are so many owners in this same situation. I am one of them. Why can’t we find someone or some organization to help us? I have written to the BBB but to no avail. Marriot/Vistana needs to be held accountable for how they are treating us during this terrible pandamic. I was thinking of contacting media (7 on your side) a tv channel in NY. I have lost thousands of points and money. Funny how we pay our maintenance religiously year after year…..to plan a much needed rare vacation…..and they rip us off !!!!!
I agree that I cannot believe that Vistana is not handling this better. They will not allow me to extend my options until 2021 and the email I received from customer service said that I should have “an opportunity to book something this fall.” Nevermind I have a 91-year-old mother and the virus is spiking all over the country. I have no idea why they will not extend the options until 2021. It makes no sense! I was so frustrated when Marriott bought us out, and the frustrations continue!
I agree that I cannot believe that Vistana is not handling this better. They will not allow me to extend my options until 2021 and the email I received from customer service said that I should have “an opportunity to book something this fall.” Nevermind I have a 91-year-old mother and the virus is spiking all over the country. I have no idea why they will not extend the options until 2021. It makes no sense! I was so frustrated when Marriott bought us out, and the frustrations continue!
Mark – great read and thank you. Don’t forget about the renters of these owners who are feeling the impact even worse. I am currently dealing with an owner whom I’ve rented from 3 years in a row at Westin Kierland Villas. We had to cancel during the last week in March. I don’t have the flexibility to travel during another week this year, to your point don’t want to go to Arizona in the summer, and she will not offer me anything in terms of a refund – $0! Additionally, there is no chance she could re-rent the same Spring Break week at WKV for March 2021 with only 120 advance booking. I even offered at one point to cover her maintenance fees and give me at least the difference and she wouldn’t budge. I’m out almost $2400 now and she won’t do anything.
We are in a similar boat, as renters from an owner. If we can’t find a time that can work given all the restrictions by Vistana, scheduling issues and pandemic stuff – we will be out $12,000 (Yes, $12,000) for our Hawaii rental (2 units with the same owner for a week). i’m not an expert in how timeshares work, and I hope the owner we rented from is being honest in what he can do – but that’s crazy to me when every other company (hotels, airlines etc) are offering credits for up to 1 year from when you were supposed to travel, that this company isn’t.
Finding space in maui 120 days out will be difficult especially during peak travel times. I just looked for August 15th since that is 120 days out and there is NOTHING! If you rented a 2 bedroom oceanview that unit is worth 148,100 options. ( option amounts vary a little in maui) If you can not find anything in Maui, have them check for the Westin Kierland ( not the Horse pass Sheraton) or Palm Desert ( desert willow and Mission Hill are both nice) during mid season. Visiting in October/November is lovely and you will be able to get more time as the options go further. Let your person who you are renting from know you know that different seasons require different options. Don’t let them book you the desert in July for 2 weeks and call it even because it wouldn’t be. Good Luck!
Great point E – I had never considered people renting time from the owners. You have even less protections – that is tough and I would hope they would work with you somehow to come to a common ground.
Failed miserably . . . We boom 12 months out as we own on Maui. 4 months means we won’t get to use our points at our home resort. If they either lifted the restrictions or let us transfer to hotel points, that would be reasonable.
Yeah I think allowing transfer to hotel points is the easiest solution and I am not sure why they are blocking that option.
This just seems like more of Marriott being anti-customer. It’s almost rite by now.
On the Vistana front, that was the name of a timeshare property near Disney around 40 years ago when I was a kid. My family stayed there once as a hotel, and they had the coolest thing ever: laser disc movies. Basically a dvd the size of an LP record. Pretty amazing stuff for the time. Anyway, Vistana obviously got purchased by a larger company and the name just happened to come out on top, IMO.
I remember Laser Discs in middle school – we had some cool learning videos with options to skip to parts of the story etc. on them. Very underrated media!
I own DVC (Disney) and there are some angry owners there as well. Normally you must “bank” your points within 4 months of the end of your use year. But they aren’t waiving that. So people who’s points expire in June, but had March, April, and May reservations could not bank those points forward. So unless they park them in RCI, they are effectively losing them. Now, they chose to travel in the last 4 months of their use year…which a more seasoned owner knows is risky. With banking and borrowing most owners had 24 months to use these points.
I think the issue with timeshares is they run at high occupancy almost the entire year. If you take months of inventory out of the system, you can’t just make availability appear out of thin air when the resorts run >95% full. I’ve seen many Disney owners angry because they are losing points and want all owners to share the “pain”. But as an owner who planned better I don’t want to subsidize owners who didn’t. I don’t want my future ability to book to be affected because DVC (or Marriott) throws the rule book out the window. I’m not saying people can predict a pandemic. But people need to know the system they are buying into. There are ways to maximize and protect yourself and ways to expose yourself to more risk.
I do think, at least in the case of my DVC, they will try and work with affected members. But I think the issue impatient owners are dealing with is timeshares can’t really come out with a full plan now until they know the extent of the closures. They can’t give relief to affected March and April owners and then down the line not give it to owners if this thing goes on through June, July, or end of the year. I think how accommodating companies like Marriott and DVC will be will 100% depend on the length of closure. For all we know they could keep stuff closed a year….then we’d all feel the pain. I know it sucks for a lot of people. But hopefully we get opened sooner than later and companies are able to offer some relief.
Great points Shaun. I think these companies could turn to their rental properties as an option for owners. While I know it is not the same as getting a 2 bedroom condo etc. getting something is better than nothing. I am not sure if they will go that route or not but it could be used to give them another option that allows them to get value and doesn’t ruin the system going forward.